Forums > Stand Up Paddle Foiling

Axis new "B" series foils and 980 front wing

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Created by wicka 1 month ago, 21 Nov 2020
Piros
QLD, 6098 posts
29 Nov 2020 5:15PM
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1010 ....

tightlines
WA, 3349 posts
29 Nov 2020 6:46PM
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Piros said..
1010 ....


I would have put money the 1020.

DWF
266 posts
29 Nov 2020 7:16PM
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tightlines said..

Piros said..
1010 ....



I would have put money the 1020.


1020 if you're a big dude. 1010 will leave you gassed and dead in the water, if the wind drops. Ask me how I know

tightlines
WA, 3349 posts
29 Nov 2020 8:10PM
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DWF said..

tightlines said..


Piros said..
1010 ....




I would have put money the 1020.



1020 if you're a big dude. 1010 will leave you gassed and dead in the water, if the wind drops. Ask me how I know


Same

Youngbreezy
WA, 714 posts
29 Nov 2020 8:20PM
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I am a big guy too 100kgs. I have both wings now but haven't used either of them for winging yet.

I was thinking the 1010 would be the daily driver on the wing and the 1020 would give me the extra low end for the lighter days.

I got the 1010 out briefly in very small weak waves and I was loving it I can't see myself needing a bigger wing for surf. I am still pretty new on the wingding though so I think I will need all the low end lift I can get.

tightlines
WA, 3349 posts
29 Nov 2020 11:11PM
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Big guy, light wind winging, 1020 with a 440 or 500 tail will deadset win hands down although as soon as there is enough wind you will have more fun on the 1010.

Piros
QLD, 6098 posts
30 Nov 2020 10:33AM
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3 of us ran the 980 DW yesterday . 2 on 5m Duotone wings and a Sup Paddle guy. some really interesting stats . Conditions were pretty much ideal with 14 to 16 at the start then getting up to 20 knots . My mate on the paddle sup did struggle to get it up and needed to get closer to the wave zone to get started but once up he flew and recorded a record time averaging 5kph faster than the 1010 on the same run . His comments where the same as ours it's so farking fast straight downwind and the glide through the gybe was just insane , effortless. There is a 1050 coming out same design as the 980 and looks like this will suit better for the paddle in guys on lower wind days. You would compare the paddle start power of the 980 to the 900.

For us on the dings it took a couple of extra pumps to get up at the start but still relatively easy , it planes up like a boat , really smooth. My top speed was 33.7 kph but mainly averaged high 20's. It's by far the smoothest, easiest to ride and control wing I have ever down winded on. Also great in the wave zone , we had a ball on it. I know I have said this before but it's incredibly fast and with all that extra speed everything just becomes easier as you are not working to keep the foil moving it just glides & glides , the pressure on your arms is so much less . I used the 390 curved down tail , Jack was on the 400 with turned up tips , I'll try my cut down flat tail next.







Alysum
NSW, 678 posts
30 Nov 2020 11:40AM
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Thanks for the feedback Piros.
I assume you meant the curved down 390 stabiliser
Were you on the short fuselage ?

Piros
QLD, 6098 posts
30 Nov 2020 10:45AM
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Yeah whoops thanks for that just fixed and yes all 3 of us were on the short .

AnyBoard
NSW, 14 posts
30 Nov 2020 12:16PM
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Looks like a hyper 190 with almost the exact dimensions from what i can tell?

Piros
QLD, 6098 posts
30 Nov 2020 11:48AM
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Yeah it's pretty close but with a slightly different foil profile and curve but agree at first glance they do look the same .

kobo
NSW, 495 posts
30 Nov 2020 2:14PM
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Piros I see you have a couple of washers shimming the mast at the back, does this keep the nose a bit higher on the fanatic? is it the 6'3 or 6'7.

Piros
QLD, 6098 posts
30 Nov 2020 3:25PM
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It actually levels it out. The 6-3 (in pic) & 6-7 still have tail rocker. I do the same on the 4-8 prone Fanatic as well

kobo
NSW, 495 posts
30 Nov 2020 5:33PM
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Thanks that's interesting, do you like the fanatic 4'8 prone ? I have the 5'2 and love it , and was thinking my next one might be the 4'8. I had the 5'2 replaced on warranty as it was a little soft in spots and developed cracks, think it must have been made on a Friday, the new one seems fine.

Piros
QLD, 6098 posts
30 Nov 2020 6:52PM
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I've had a busted shoulder last 3 months so being using the 4-8 for a bit more float and paddle power . My daily rider is a 4-6 x 29 litre DC I'm 89 kg ATM . The 5-2 in my eyes is a big prone board so the 4-8 would be a good choice coming down off the 5-2 .

Chasing Bumps
QLD, 21 posts
30 Nov 2020 8:44PM
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I've done 2 paddle 10km+ downwinders on the 980 now in pretty good condtions (15-20knots) (Riding the downcurved tail)
I normally ride the 900 for surf and ding and the 1010 only for paddle downwinders. Im 74kg and fit enough.
The 980 seems to be "up to" 5km per hour faster than the 1010 on my 1km splits. Def faster and to be honest I wasn't enjoying the 101 in the end as for some reason I felt like I was wrestling it too much. Not sure why so many people rave about it but thats just me.
The 980 is not easy to get up. Similar to the 900 which I could never really crack from dw paddle so opted for the 1010 which was easy for me but too slow to latch onto the big fast bumps.
Today I did pretty good and got the 980 up in some pretty small bumps - but its a lot of work and technique. I think avg Joe will def need a bigger version for dw paddling. For the ding will be great.
Havent had it in good surf yet so I'll reserve my surf judgement as I still love my 900 on the SUP, but I'm sure I'm going to get addcited to the extra speed - and yes it pumps well. Slightly different technique but great glide and as Piros says it just flies across the flat sections.
It needs to be moving then it just holds it speed so well.
Yes Axis piss me off too like every other foil brand where you think the next wing is the next big thing and will finally be the magic one to solve all your kook problems and you fork out again, and again.
Truth is everyone seems to want a wing for a different thing and I see lot of forums filled with dingers and flat water wanna-be pumpers giving advice to prone surfers, and people who just wanna swear by a brand because you'd think they were sponsored or something etc

So my quick summary verdict for "dw paddling only" - faster, enough to crack the next level where you are moving over and through bumps you used to have to turn off. So the 10% extra speed or whatever you'll have to pay for, for me personally well worth it, as it got me to the next critical level of DW that is a must to breakthrough. Suddenly I'm looking 3-4 bumps ahead to mow down rather than for the valley next door and lathcing onto groundswells that used to pass me by. I'm getting close enough to the fastest guys now to be content for my age.
BUT she is tough to get up. Just compare it to the 900 for simplicity sake. No point paddling around for 10 mins trying to get up. Maybe wait for a bigger version that will be close in speed.

Or fxxx it just buy another wing... lifes too short to spend it on your wife and kids.

pps I'm sure GoFoil, Takuma and some other soon to be released wings from the One crew are prob better as I've been passed by them plenty of times. Axis just have me by the balls and it's too cheap to get "just one more" rather than change a whole setup.

Piros
QLD, 6098 posts
30 Nov 2020 10:46PM
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Good review Mr Rennie and agree the super high aspect is not for everyone but put in the hard yards and reap the rewards . The 1010 is a good stepping stone to the even higher aspect wings , do your time on that and then take the leap. Don't get caught in the hype and make the jump too soon but it's something you should definitely be aiming for .

frenchfoiler
213 posts
1 Dec 2020 12:34AM
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Any information about smaller wing for prone ?? I hope they come up with a small hight aspect wing.

Thatspec
WA, 51 posts
1 Dec 2020 1:27AM
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Great review Mr Rennie and thanks for the stats Piros! I appreciate the honest no hype info as you've both presented it.
Those of you that already own a nice red fuse and 910/1010/1150 should take note, your gear is not all of a sudden worthless garbage. After approx. 70 downwinders last summer, my average top speed was 32 Kph (19-20MPH) on the 1010/390 ultra short combo, 19mm mast, no shims, 90Kg. That's against a significant river current as well (gorge). Also able to jump ahead waves pretty much at will.

Now this looks like a really nice piece of kit and I'd buy (the 1050, the 980 is too small) in a heartbeat but already owning what I do, should I spend 1500AUD to MAYBE go a hair faster? Short answer... no, maybe in 2022.

Holoholo
108 posts
1 Dec 2020 1:38AM
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frenchfoiler said..
Any information about smaller wing for prone ?? I hope they come up with a small hight aspect wing.


The rumor mill says: 930, 880, 700.

Piros
QLD, 6098 posts
1 Dec 2020 4:52AM
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frenchfoiler said..
Any information about smaller wing for prone ?? I hope they come up with a small hight aspect wing.

Yeah my mate rode it he's only 75 kg and loved it , super fast said it's the fastest thing he has ridden and he can still pump it but he is the pump king , it's more for towing . He rides the new NP/HP and only negative the 700 didn't carve or turn as hard as his NP. When you see the 700 in the flesh it's tiny . See in this pic up against the 980 . There is heaps more wings coming out.

I proned the 980 super fast and absolute killer on the pump it does turn well but slides. For the prone I'm looking forward to a smaller version as well plus a carbon mast and wish the new Black fuse was carbon , it's a touch lighter than the red but still a bit of weight in it. It's all good on the Ding and Sup but really notice it when I switch over from my other full carbon rigs on the prone carrying it on those long walk backs.

I

Piros
QLD, 6098 posts
1 Dec 2020 9:16AM
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Comparison pics of the 1010 & 980 big difference in cord and wing tips . Have a look how more streamlined the black fuse connection is on the 980 compared to the 1010.



Alysum
NSW, 678 posts
1 Dec 2020 10:46AM
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I tried the 980 yesterday on the wing coupled with the 390 stab and the ultra short fuse (644mm).

It is fast and glides nicely. I didn't have any issues getting it going. But also quite twitchy. Someone came up with the term "hobby horsing" which describes the up/down pulses coming from too much lift, going super fast, picking up too much energy, from the chopping surface.
Is this normal on all thin flat wings ? Any suggestions on how to make it a bit more stable ?

emmafoils
255 posts
1 Dec 2020 8:14AM
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Alysum said..
I tried the 980 yesterday on the wing coupled with the 390 stab and the ultra short fuse (644mm).

It is fast and glides nicely. I didn't have any issues getting it going. But also quite twitchy. Someone came up with the term "hobby horsing" which describes the up/down pulses coming from too much lift, going super fast, picking up too much energy, from the chopping surface.
Is this normal on all thin flat wings ? Any suggestions on how to make it a bit more stable ?


Higher AR wings are much more sensitive to changes in angle of attack. A longer fuse will help this pitch sensitivity but you will probably get used to it pretty quickly.

Chasing Bumps
QLD, 21 posts
1 Dec 2020 6:05PM
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Alysum - love that term hobby horsing.
I found that on the 101 and that it couldn't handle the steep drops well. You lean back to stop nose diving then it would suddenly leap up.
Whereas for some reason my 900 handles really steep drops smoothly.
At first I though the 980 was suffering a bit of hobby horsing but I cracked a couple after I committed. Frothing to test it in some bigger surf first. Letting go of my ol faithful 900 is going take some further r &d !

Alysum
NSW, 678 posts
1 Dec 2020 9:42PM
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Ok so hobby horsing is normal for those very flat wings ?

I never experienced that with the 1000HA wing.

I'm wondering whether the short fuselage would be better to counter this (over the ultra short) but then I'd lose some pumping and turning.
Even turning on the 980 feels very strange, it feels like standing on a plank that doesn't want to turn but it skips sideways.
I noticed I touch down a lot more with the 980.
I guess I could get used to it, definitely prefer the stability and turnability of the 1000HA but I like the extra speed and glide of the 980.

DWF
266 posts
1 Dec 2020 11:01PM
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Alysum said..
I tried the 980 yesterday on the wing coupled with the 390 stab and the ultra short fuse (644mm).

It is fast and glides nicely. I didn't have any issues getting it going. But also quite twitchy. Someone came up with the term "hobby horsing" which describes the up/down pulses coming from too much lift, going super fast, picking up too much energy, from the chopping surface.
Is this normal on all thin flat wings ? Any suggestions on how to make it a bit more stable ?


Try it with the short fuse and 420 tail. It's a completely different animal.

A low drag front wing, really needs an ultra low drag tail, and thin foils work better on longer fuselages. All that you experienced goes away and it releases full beast mode.

Alysum
NSW, 678 posts
3 Dec 2020 6:37PM
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DWF said..

Alysum said..
I tried the 980 yesterday on the wing coupled with the 390 stab and the ultra short fuse (644mm).

It is fast and glides nicely. I didn't have any issues getting it going. But also quite twitchy. Someone came up with the term "hobby horsing" which describes the up/down pulses coming from too much lift, going super fast, picking up too much energy, from the chopping surface.
Is this normal on all thin flat wings ? Any suggestions on how to make it a bit more stable ?



Try it with the short fuse and 420 tail. It's a completely different animal.

A low drag front wing, really needs an ultra low drag tail, and thin foils work better on longer fuselages. All that you experienced goes away and it releases full beast mode.


Yes thanks Adrian also said to go with the 420. However since I have a short fuselage S series I'm keen to go ultra short for the black series. Mainly for the pumping and to assist with turning since its less turning than anything S series.

DWF
266 posts
4 Dec 2020 7:21PM
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Alysum said..

Yes thanks Adrian also said to go with the 420. However since I have a short fuselage S series I'm keen to go ultra short for the black series. Mainly for the pumping and to assist with turning since its less turning than anything S series.


Keep in mind thin foils don't like to be over worked (pumped too aggressively)

They don't have the thickness to handle big changes in AOA without flow separation. Less is more.

Longer fuse helps.

hairybear01
SA, 30 posts
5 Dec 2020 9:01AM
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I'm not a team rider just an average customer and pay allot of money for all my gear.

Ok so Axis is now running with two different standards for fuselage mount to wings red and black.
As a foil addict this is giving me a headache. Do I run with two different fuselage standards. Do I sell all my red wings and change to black. Has the red resale value gone out the window? Do I change to another brand. They don't appear to be backward compatible WTF?

Solution needed: Is it possible to engineer an alloy adaptor plate that screws to old wings that we can bolt the black fuselage to? Only need to run black fuse with plates on red wings?

Even better can we make a fuselage that fits both red and black? Red wings now compatible to black and not totally redundant.?



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"Axis new "B" series foils and 980 front wing" started by wicka