Forums > Stand Up Paddle Foiling

Go Foil users... how about one of these?

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Created by StampnSteer 1 month ago, 25 May 2020
StampnSteer
40 posts
25 May 2020 1:16PM
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So I'm getting better at surf foiling on my SUP, but I keep breaching on my standard Go Foil mast. "Get a 29" mast", I hear you say...but that's another $1200 bucks ;-((

So with my carbon engineering hat on.... why cant I make an adapter plate that's not 2" long, but 6"? It may change the flex pattern of the chord a little, I guess, but is that a deal breaker?

So, Q: As a go foil user, would you buy an adapter plate for, say, $300 that extended your mast by 6"?

Interested in your feedback ;-)

container
13 posts
25 May 2020 1:34PM
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sure no reason at all. just remember to put plenty of carbon on it as this is where 100% of the load is. if you make it just like a short mast with the tuttle box in the bottom then you will hardly notice the extra drag


StampnSteer
40 posts
25 May 2020 1:40PM
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container said..
sure no reason at all. just remember to put plenty of carbon on it as this is where 100% of the load is. if you make it just like a short mast with the tuttle box in the bottom then you will hardly notice the extra drag



Yeah - I'm thinking go foil would rather sell $1200 masts, so they wont make 'em. But surely a carbon preg solution could work? That's how they make the current adapters. I guess aluminium would be too weak?

container
13 posts
25 May 2020 1:42PM
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i'd say ali would just bend, there wouldn't be a lot of meat around the corners of the box where all the stress is. no reason a carbon one wouldn't work and you're probably dead right, why sell a $200 adapter when you can sell a $1200 mast.

Stingersup
WA, 30 posts
25 May 2020 5:00PM
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If you used aluminium there's no reason why you couldn't oversize it to get the strength. It's not as if it's going to spend much time in the water. Coming up with a design that could be cnc'd would be reasonably easy. I reckon a mast length of around 75-80cm is the sweet spot.

Seajuice
NSW, 620 posts
25 May 2020 9:11PM
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Before even getting into making an extension or buying a longer mast. Have you been foiling long enough to understand how to react to the dips & troughs on the water surface. Is your technique right so that you don't breach? Is your foil wing too big? Is your foil set too far forward? Is the water depth too shallow.
In my experience being 80kgs in weight I feel much more comfortable using a medium sized wing, (NeilPryde) in shoulder to overhead waves than using a large foil wing on my SUP. But even then I have to react to the dips & troughs of the water surface that's caused from wind chop & side swells. Same as when riding a bike on trails with a law inside your head saying keep both wheels on ground when riding into dips & troughs otherwise your disqualified!
So if your front wheel goes up then you're out! Same with foiling. If you see a trough in front, go down into it & not straight ahead or up. That's when you breach & go over & nose dive. Reading the surface gives the best advantage & becomes automatic over time.
I too want a longer mast at about 75cm or 29.5 inches for my medium wing foil on those head high heavy waves with chop & side swells. And probably will need one in future when using a wingding. Not easy saving dollars without a job.
An extension between the mast and board will definitely have to be made strong. That is the area one of my masts have bent a few times in side on wave hits.
If one can be made at the fuselarge then I believe there would be less stress acting against it. But how do you make one there that will be streamlined enough?

DWF
204 posts
25 May 2020 7:13PM
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They already have this adapter.....the GoFoil team riders who get custom parts direct from Alex. Hand made in Maui.

juandesooka
353 posts
26 May 2020 12:34AM
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If you are using the tuttle, they do have an adapter as DWF says...buddy has one, extends it about 4". Or if you are using the base plate adapter, that already adds 3", effectively a 27".

I am using the base plate adapter on surf foil and then the 24" tuttle on sup foil, both work fine in surf, very rarely breach. Though for winging, in high winds with large wind chop, I find need to slow down a lot to avoid breaching through the wind waves. So the longer mast would be helpful there.

I agree with SeaJuice ... If you are breaching a lot, then you are likely over-winged. My rule is that the Maliko 200 is for waist high waves maximum, any bigger than that, you should be on a smaller wing. And you will be stoked when you do ... suddenly those drops that you are on tiptoes just barely hanging on, you can drive through hard with confidence. You can also go way faster and do sharper turns. [keeping in mind GF doesn't even market these Malikos for surf, they are made for downwinding, using them in surf actually voids the warranty...which I find quite bizarre, as they are excellent in small surf]

With everyone going to the GL high aspect series, there are "cheap" older style wings for sale ... watch the Hawaii craigslist for the best deals, shipping is expensive, but a lot cheaper than buying new! You can also probably get an entire combo with the 29" mast and multiple wings for $1000ish US....and then you have all the smaller wings too and a spare mast. Awesome to have surf foil and sup foil both set up on the beach and switch off! More gear is good. :-)


StampnSteer
40 posts
26 May 2020 4:26AM
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Stingersup said..
If you used aluminium there's no reason why you couldn't oversize it to get the strength. It's not as if it's going to spend much time in the water. Coming up with a design that could be cnc'd would be reasonably easy. I reckon a mast length of around 75-80cm is the sweet spot.


Yup - pretty easy CNC job, as you say...

StampnSteer
40 posts
26 May 2020 4:33AM
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Seajuice said..
Before even getting into making an extension or buying a longer mast. Have you been foiling long enough to understand how to react to the dips & troughs on the water surface. Is your technique right so that you don't breach? Is your foil wing too big? Is your foil set too far forward? Is the water depth too shallow.
In my experience being 80kgs in weight I feel much more comfortable using a medium sized wing, (NeilPryde) in shoulder to overhead waves than using a large foil wing on my SUP. But even then I have to react to the dips & troughs of the water surface that's caused from wind chop & side swells. Same as when riding a bike on trails with a law inside your head saying keep both wheels on ground when riding into dips & troughs otherwise your disqualified!
So if your front wheel goes up then you're out! Same with foiling. If you see a trough in front, go down into it & not straight ahead or up. That's when you breach & go over & nose dive. Reading the surface gives the best advantage & becomes automatic over time.
I too want a longer mast at about 75cm or 29.5 inches for my medium wing foil on those head high heavy waves with chop & side swells. And probably will need one in future when using a wingding. Not easy saving dollars without a job.
An extension between the mast and board will definitely have to be made strong. That is the area one of my masts have bent a few times in side on wave hits.
If one can be made at the fuselarge then I believe there would be less stress acting against it. But how do you make one there that will be streamlined enough?


Hi Seajuice! Few of us are expert, let's be honest ;-) But yes, I could be over-winged as i'm using a Maliko 200. And, yes I have a job ;-) But my point is really this: the carbon gear is damn expensive, unless you buy aluminium. So why should riders have to pay $1200 for a whole new mast, just to add a few inches? I want to be able to run 25" on beach days, and 29" on big waves. Maybe a better solution (although not for go foil) is to simply use an adapter? If you have $$$$$ to spend, then all good. But most of us have a huge investment already - I might wilingly spend a few hundred to get another option. Personally, I'd love a few mast lengths to suit condiitons... but I don't have thousands to spend. Kia kaha.

StampnSteer
40 posts
26 May 2020 4:37AM
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juandesooka said..

If you are using the tuttle, they do have an adapter as DWF says...buddy has one, extends it about 4". Or if you are using the base plate adapter, that already adds 3", effectively a 27".

I am using the base plate adapter on surf foil and then the 24" tuttle on sup foil, both work fine in surf, very rarely breach. Though for winging, in high winds with large wind chop, I find need to slow down a lot to avoid breaching through the wind waves. So the longer mast would be helpful there.

I agree with SeaJuice ... If you are breaching a lot, then you are likely over-winged. My rule is that the Maliko 200 is for waist high waves maximum, any bigger than that, you should be on a smaller wing. And you will be stoked when you do ... suddenly those drops that you are on tiptoes just barely hanging on, you can drive through hard with confidence. You can also go way faster and do sharper turns. [keeping in mind GF doesn't even market these Malikos for surf, they are made for downwinding, using them in surf actually voids the warranty...which I find quite bizarre, as they are excellent in small surf]

With everyone going to the GL high aspect series, there are "cheap" older style wings for sale ... watch the Hawaii craigslist for the best deals, shipping is expensive, but a lot cheaper than buying new! You can also probably get an entire combo with the 29" mast and multiple wings for $1000ish US....and then you have all the smaller wings too and a spare mast. Awesome to have surf foil and sup foil both set up on the beach and switch off! More gear is good. :-)




Thanks man, good points. I'm just thinking adapters might be a more cost effective way to get some alternative mast lengths. I'm 90kg running a Maliko 200. When I'm in shoulder high surf or wing foiling... it's running real high. Breaches are never far away. Maybe I'll get my Iwa out and try that again ;-)

Seajuice
NSW, 620 posts
26 May 2020 9:56AM
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Yeah try the IWA. I think it's close in size to the NP large. For your weight I think you'll have better control in surf. But I think an extension with your 200 would be better for the wind wing.
And agree entirely that prices are far too high for foils & their parts! I just laugh at the price of simple stainless bolts That you can get for much cheaper elsewhere.
Another thing I thought of a while ago was to get a 100mm/5inch thick plate between the original mast adapter plate & the board with the front of it V shaped to make it a little streamlined But! You will need longer track box bolts. And not sure what extra stresses it will make on the track box.
Just wondering if anyone has tried similar?
Sometimes I wonder if riders are getting too used to flying high and get disappointed when breaching when water surface changes.
But it would definitey be an advantage for wind wings, side swells & large chop. Plus high performance surfing.
But for shallower water & reefs 50 or 60cm masts are great.

jondrums
20 posts
26 May 2020 1:03PM
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My suggestion in general is to stop blaming the gear. You need to ride more until you know what gear changes you really need. You can go a long way on a 24" mast. I know because I rode one for more than a year before they even made a longer version. Once I got the longer one, it immediately made sense, but to be honest it would be harder to learn on. If you're breaching, a longer mast isn't the solution - better awareness of your height is

pohaku
NSW, 487 posts
26 May 2020 5:40PM
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If your 90kg and riding a M200 in large surf i get why your breaching. The M200 has a ton of initial lift. your better off putting your money into a Gl210 or 180, less initial lift and will hold a ton more speed.

StampnSteer
40 posts
26 May 2020 5:18PM
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jondrums said..
My suggestion in general is to stop blaming the gear. You need to ride more until you know what gear changes you really need. You can go a long way on a 24" mast. I know because I rode one for more than a year before they even made a longer version. Once I got the longer one, it immediately made sense, but to be honest it would be harder to learn on. If you're breaching, a longer mast isn't the solution - better awareness of your height is


Yup - I get that. It might just be nice to have a wider operating window. But, yes... no point blaming the gear.

juandesooka
353 posts
27 May 2020 2:05AM
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This is what you seek. It adds 3" to the tuttle mast. A buddy got it as part of the package when he bought a used GF setup from Maui ... but in a google search, I haven't found a source yet.



StampnSteer
40 posts
27 May 2020 4:34PM
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juandesooka said..
This is what you seek. It adds 3" to the tuttle mast. A buddy got it as part of the package when he bought a used GF setup from Maui ... but in a google search, I haven't found a source yet.




YES! Another solution... extend the tuttle! I absolutely need one of these... so where can we find them? Who would know...? GETTING CLOSE... I CAN FEEL IT ;-)

StampnSteer
40 posts
27 May 2020 4:44PM
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StampnSteer said..

juandesooka said..
This is what you seek. It adds 3" to the tuttle mast. A buddy got it as part of the package when he bought a used GF setup from Maui ... but in a google search, I haven't found a source yet.




YES! Another solution... extend the tuttle! I absolutely need one of these... so where can we find them? Who would know...? GETTING CLOSE... I CAN FEEL IT ;-)


Can you ask your buddy if he knows? Or give me his contact details and I'll run it down? Cheers

DWF
204 posts
27 May 2020 6:51PM
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Those are the ones made by Alex. I think you'd have to find a team rider willing to part with one.

StampnSteer
40 posts
28 May 2020 3:23AM
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DWF said..
Those are the ones made by Alex. I think you'd have to find a team rider willing to part with one.


If they are 'team rider only' gear then I'm even more interested! Who is Alex, and where can I find him ;-)

container
13 posts
28 May 2020 4:03AM
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Alex aguera, creator of Gofoil. Ask any local composite boatbuilder, that fitting wont be very hard to make

StampnSteer
40 posts
28 May 2020 5:58AM
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container said..
Alex aguera, creator of Gofoil. Ask any local composite boatbuilder, that fitting wont be very hard to make


Cool. Thanks for the clarification.

jondrums
20 posts
29 May 2020 4:53AM
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I think someone already mentioned this, but I really think you're going to get the most bang for your buck out of a smaller thinner wing. The IWA would suit your 90kg perfectly on all but the smallest/slowest waves. Lots of the old gen wings showing up for sale pretty cheaply here and there. The M200 is really a slug, it has tons of lift but also tons of drag and is really slow. It can't handle speed, and I think that's what you're reacting to. A longer mast isn't going to help that.

StampnSteer
40 posts
30 May 2020 2:12PM
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jondrums said..
I think someone already mentioned this, but I really think you're going to get the most bang for your buck out of a smaller thinner wing. The IWA would suit your 90kg perfectly on all but the smallest/slowest waves. Lots of the old gen wings showing up for sale pretty cheaply here and there. The M200 is really a slug, it has tons of lift but also tons of drag and is really slow. It can't handle speed, and I think that's what you're reacting to. A longer mast isn't going to help that.


Agreed. I have an IWA, so I'll start using that for proper size surf ;-)



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"Go Foil users... how about one of these?" started by StampnSteer