Forums > Stand Up Paddle Foiling

Looking to start wing foiling

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Created by Macca1410 4 months ago, 9 Jan 2020
AndyShwartz
WA, 75 posts
15 Jan 2020 6:44PM
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Macca1410 said..
So went to WSS Boards today. Thanks heaps to the boys there for their advice. Really helpful stuff. Ended up getting the Sunova 2 in 1 foilboard eco 7'4" 111L. For me being a total beginner this seems to be a good choice. I know it is big but for a total beginner this is what I needed so not to get too frustrated and give up.
Went to Kyeemagh for a session and Dietar was down there and was really helpful and generous with his time to help me out. So a couple of hours on the water and I am still a muppet but definitely know more now than I did yesterday. Found it hard to get up on my feet to start with but found the wing much easier to handle than a kite in kitesurfing. Once on my feet the wing was heaps easier to control than when on my knees which was pleasing.

For someone like me with little water sport experience this is a great sport to start with. Even though I spent most of my time trudging back to my starting point I found it great fun and much better walking back up beach than anything else I would have been doing. Can't wait to get out again and improve, officially hooked.


I'm pretty new too...
My first session with the wing and my Normal SUP was so fun. I ran about 4km back to my car doing two downwinders. That was enough to sail and gybe.

Getting up on the foil has been fun and frustrating. Being so stoked I went too hard too fast and lots of pain everywhere.

Now in recovery and buying a new bigger board. I admit once you get up on the foil your board does feel massive but you do need the stability as you get tired (which is really quick!)

Macca1410
NSW, 38 posts
2 Mar 2020 3:30PM
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So back with some more questions please.

I have had my board and Ozone Wasp 4m wing 6 weeks now and have been out for 5 sessions on relatively flat water. As a total novice it has taken me longer to work this all out than most I imagine. In hindsight however, only this last weekend was in conditions that were close to ideal. All the other sessions were in much less wind or conditions too choppy, but good to practice in all conditions as it is rarely ideal. So all up has taken me about 7 hours to cruise along with the wing on my 2 in 1 Sunova with fins (no foil yet).

I can now stay up wind, turn and basically stay out as long as I like and end up back where I started. So pumped that I do not have to do the walk of shame any longer.

So my question now is onto the foil. Below is my board for info. Weighed myself yesterday and I am 68kgs. I know people will say get a smaller, foil specific board but this is what I have for now so advise on a set up for this board would be great.

Sunova 2 in 1 Foilboard Eco
7'4"
111L
Foil system: 2 track and tuttle

Any recommendations on foil size and brand would be much appreciated. Assume I want a larger, slower one for beginning on.

Also, I do not have foot straps on my board. Do you need them? Can they be retrofitted if need be?

Thanks

hilly
WA, 5260 posts
2 Mar 2020 3:53PM
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Macca1410 said..
Assume I want a larger, slower one for beginning on.



Yes if light wind really large 2000cm plus. I use a 2400 and it goes really well. Strong wing 1200 to 1600cm. 70cm mast



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Macca1410 said..
Also, I do not have foot straps on my board. Do you need them? Can they be retrofitted if need be?



No not need but Yes you can fit

Axis, GoFoil, NP, Armstrong, Naish, Fanatic, Unifoil, Takuma, etc all make foils that would suit. If you want to save money buy secondhand. Because you are learning you do not need the latest and greatest but if you get foil brain it will save you money in the long run.
Look for wing compatibility as well some brands eg GoFoil not all wings fit all fuselages and masts.

The journey is the fun part enjoy.

Macca1410
NSW, 38 posts
3 Mar 2020 8:39AM
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hilly said..

Macca1410 said..
Assume I want a larger, slower one for beginning on.




Yes if light wind really large 2000cm plus. I use a 2400 and it goes really well. Strong wing 1200 to 1600cm. 70cm mast




Macca1410 said..
Also, I do not have foot straps on my board. Do you need them? Can they be retrofitted if need be?




No not need but Yes you can fit

Axis, GoFoil, NP, Armstrong, Naish, Fanatic, Unifoil, Takuma, etc all make foils that would suit. If you want to save money buy secondhand. Because you are learning you do not need the latest and greatest but if you get foil brain it will save you money in the long run.
Look for wing compatibility as well some brands eg GoFoil not all wings fit all fuselages and masts.

The journey is the fun part enjoy.


Thanks for the input guys. Lots of research to do. As you say all part of the journey.
Cant sleep with the excitement of getting on a foil.

hilly
WA, 5260 posts
3 Mar 2020 1:05PM
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Stay away from waves




kobo
NSW, 215 posts
3 Mar 2020 4:25PM
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Bugger ,how did it happen?

hilly
WA, 5260 posts
3 Mar 2020 2:25PM
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kobo said..
Bugger ,how did it happen?


Caught inside after a wipe out on a small day. Leash point related not foil related as I had the board.

Macca1410
NSW, 38 posts
3 Mar 2020 5:42PM
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Expensive accident. Repairable? Will take your advice hilly. Sorry to see that.


So me being impatient and all, I have gone and bought the following:

www.naishfoils.com/product/surf-foil-jet-1650-complete-abracadabra/

Gets delivered in next couple of days. Praying for decent conditions on the weekend.



hilly
WA, 5260 posts
3 Mar 2020 3:06PM
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Macca1410 said..
Expensive accident. Repairable? Will take your advice hilly. Sorry to see that.


So me being impatient and all, I have gone and bought the following:

www.naishfoils.com/product/surf-foil-jet-1650-complete-abracadabra/

Gets delivered in next couple of days. Praying for decent conditions on the weekend.





Fixable. Foil looks nice. JB would be proud

Macca1410
NSW, 38 posts
3 Mar 2020 6:11PM
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hilly said..

Macca1410 said..
Expensive accident. Repairable? Will take your advice hilly. Sorry to see that.


So me being impatient and all, I have gone and bought the following:

www.naishfoils.com/product/surf-foil-jet-1650-complete-abracadabra/

Gets delivered in next couple of days. Praying for decent conditions on the weekend.






Fixable. Foil looks nice. JB would be proud


Reading JB's posts on it when it came out last year definitely swayed my decision.

Good luck fixing the wing.

kobo
NSW, 215 posts
3 Mar 2020 6:37PM
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Macca1410 said..
Expensive accident. Repairable? Will take your advice hilly. Sorry to see that.


So me being impatient and all, I have gone and bought the following:

www.naishfoils.com/product/surf-foil-jet-1650-complete-abracadabra/

Gets delivered in next couple of days. Praying for decent conditions on the weekend.





Had a ride on a mates foil same as you are getting Macca ,and it will be perfect for wind foiling I recon.

colas
3836 posts
3 Mar 2020 3:49PM
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This failure is very common. Wing struts are quite large, and if the wing is folded by a wave the reduction of available volume in the strut is huge and it bursts. It doesn't help that pressure manifolds on the pumps are often unreliable and you can unknowingly put too much pressure in your wing. Basically avoid any situation where the wing could fold under pressure.

Kite shops can repair it easily, and avid wave wing foilers have begun to learn to repair it themselves. Just like with SUPs most of us learnt how to repair dings :-)

There are some tutorial vids on youtube, such as:

Macca1410
NSW, 38 posts
3 Mar 2020 7:22PM
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kobo said..

Macca1410 said..
Expensive accident. Repairable? Will take your advice hilly. Sorry to see that.


So me being impatient and all, I have gone and bought the following:

www.naishfoils.com/product/surf-foil-jet-1650-complete-abracadabra/

Gets delivered in next couple of days. Praying for decent conditions on the weekend.






Had a ride on a mates foil same as you are getting Macca ,and it will be perfect for wind foiling I recon.


Good to hear kobo. Now if only I did not have to work.

knatti
6 posts
3 Mar 2020 11:40PM
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Macca1410 said..

Does anyone know anything about these products and if they are any good? Any other suggestions would be appreciated.
...


Hello
just an update to the original Question.
In this german forum there are some discussions about the manta board (just use translator to get the most info)
surfforum.oase.com/showthread.php?t=177058

I will test the Indiana inflatable board (not available yet), looks quite stiff in this video


knatti

knatti
6 posts
3 Mar 2020 11:40PM
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Macca1410 said..

Does anyone know anything about these products and if they are any good? Any other suggestions would be appreciated.
...


Hello
just an update to the original Question.
In this german forum there are some discussions about the manta board (just use translator to get the most info)
surfforum.oase.com/showthread.php?t=177058

I will test the Indiana inflatable board (not available yet), looks quite stiff in this video


knatti

Macca1410
NSW, 38 posts
4 Mar 2020 11:07AM
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knatti said..

Macca1410 said..

Does anyone know anything about these products and if they are any good? Any other suggestions would be appreciated.
...



Hello
just an update to the original Question.
In this german forum there are some discussions about the manta board (just use translator to get the most info)
surfforum.oase.com/showthread.php?t=177058

I will test the Indiana inflatable board (not available yet), looks quite stiff in this video


knatti


Looks pretty good. I still may get an inflatable down the track for travelling with.
Another question to the wider community. Can you use the wing when it is raining? Not pissing down but in showers? I ask because tomorrow's winds look good in Sydney but it is raining. Just want to get out as much as possible. I am gonna get wet anyway. Thanks

Hdip
61 posts
4 Mar 2020 12:23PM
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You have to dry off kites when they get fresh water on them or they will mildew and get moldy. Salt water is ok. You can put them away wet if it's just salt water. I'd wager the same is true for wings.

Macca1410
NSW, 38 posts
4 Mar 2020 8:07PM
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Hdip said..
You have to dry off kites when they get fresh water on them or they will mildew and get moldy. Salt water is ok. You can put them away wet if it's just salt water. I'd wager the same is true for wings.


Didn't think of the fresh water aspect. Very true. Thanks Hdip. To be fair I always dry my wing out before packing away though.

Macca1410
NSW, 38 posts
31 Mar 2020 8:47PM
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Hi all, been out a fair few times now and lovn winging. Just can't seem to get up on my foil. Guess it will come with more practice. Will be out trying again tomorrow.
I noticed when washing down my foil and mast on the weekend that I had some water maybe 50ml splashing around in the mast. I have a Naish current model mast. Is this normal? Thanks

SolentFoiler
5 posts
1 Apr 2020 2:09PM
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Macca1410 said..
Hi all, been out a fair few times now and lovn winging. Just can't seem to get up on my foil. Guess it will come with more practice. Will be out trying again tomorrow.
I noticed when washing down my foil and mast on the weekend that I had some water maybe 50ml splashing around in the mast. I have a Naish current model mast. Is this normal? Thanks


Don't know if it's 'normal' but it's happened to mine as well. Bit annoying... I've found it'll mostly drain if you leave it vertical but not all the water comes out. In fact you've reminded me to try and sort it out...

Alysum
NSW, 459 posts
2 Apr 2020 10:19AM
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The axis foils have water at both ends of the masts too where the attachments slots in, this is by design... something we have to get used to.

juandesooka
339 posts
2 Apr 2020 7:29AM
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Macca1410 said..
Hi all, been out a fair few times now and lovn winging. Just can't seem to get up on my foil. Guess it will come with more practice. Will be out trying again tomorrow.
I noticed when washing down my foil and mast on the weekend that I had some water maybe 50ml splashing around in the mast. I have a Naish current model mast. Is this normal? Thanks


With that 4m ozone, you'll want solid 20kt for learning. And as large a foil as you can find as far forward as it goes. What is surface area of your foil? The unpleasant surprise with winging is it takes more wind than you'd think you need. Similar to learning kiting, you want to be nicely powered when you're learning. Later on, when you learn efficiencies, you can find power on lighter wind days and economize your movements to maximize it.

I don't know if you're a wind chaser otherwise, but from beginning kiting I can tell you most newbies completely overestimate wind strengths. All those blown out surf days? Not even close, 6-8kts wrecks the surf but isn't enough for anything fun in the wind. Test #1: if you turn and walk with the wind, if you don't feel it on the back of your head, it's under 10kts. Test #2: if water has no real texture, then it's under 15kt...at 15 you'll start to see tiny little caps here and there. 20kt plus you start to see lots more caps and the wind waves will make it hard to stand on a little sup foil. Having a cheap anemometer is a good investment at the start, to add some reality to the "stoke goggles". :-)

But luckily, getting in wrong with winging just means tired arms and maybe a long paddle. Getting it wrong kiting is a world of hurt.

Macca1410
NSW, 38 posts
2 Apr 2020 8:49PM
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Good to know I am not the only one with water in the mast, thought it was a fault. Will look to store it vertical to see if some of it drains out.

Thanks for the feedback.

Macca1410
NSW, 38 posts
2 Apr 2020 9:01PM
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juandesooka said..

Macca1410 said..
Hi all, been out a fair few times now and lovn winging. Just can't seem to get up on my foil. Guess it will come with more practice. Will be out trying again tomorrow.
I noticed when washing down my foil and mast on the weekend that I had some water maybe 50ml splashing around in the mast. I have a Naish current model mast. Is this normal? Thanks



With that 4m ozone, you'll want solid 20kt for learning. And as large a foil as you can find as far forward as it goes. What is surface area of your foil? The unpleasant surprise with winging is it takes more wind than you'd think you need. Similar to learning kiting, you want to be nicely powered when you're learning. Later on, when you learn efficiencies, you can find power on lighter wind days and economize your movements to maximize it.

I don't know if you're a wind chaser otherwise, but from beginning kiting I can tell you most newbies completely overestimate wind strengths. All those blown out surf days? Not even close, 6-8kts wrecks the surf but isn't enough for anything fun in the wind. Test #1: if you turn and walk with the wind, if you don't feel it on the back of your head, it's under 10kts. Test #2: if water has no real texture, then it's under 15kt...at 15 you'll start to see tiny little caps here and there. 20kt plus you start to see lots more caps and the wind waves will make it hard to stand on a little sup foil. Having a cheap anemometer is a good investment at the start, to add some reality to the "stoke goggles". :-)

But luckily, getting in wrong with winging just means tired arms and maybe a long paddle. Getting it wrong kiting is a world of hurt.


Thanks fo re advice juandesooka. Much appreciated. I think you are right about needing more wind. I am there pumping the board and wing as much as I can and still not getting up. No doubt most is due to my poor technique as in the same wind 12-15 knots I see heaps of other guys up. As you say once you have more experience it will be easier to get up in lighter winds.

My foil is 1,650cm2 got this size as thought it would be fine once I worked it out compared to a bigger front wing to start with. Also thinking of buying a 6m wing to help in the light winds.

I do go out on any day that is even half decent (and I am free). Couple of times been the only person out on the water as no one else thinks it is worth it and find it frustrating as do not get going much but at least I learn something each time.

Thanks for advice on understanding wind strength will take all that on board.

Cheers

dejavu
129 posts
3 Apr 2020 9:44PM
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These products look interesting -- wing foil board and 7 metre to 3 metre wings.

www.takuma-concept.com/91-452-zk-mini-sup.html#/70-size-54x24_1_2x4_7_8_88l

Youngbreezy
WA, 639 posts
4 Apr 2020 2:17PM
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Well I just had my first go at winging and despite having watched a lot of videos of people who rip I actually didn't get up and start shredding instantly!

Wierd I know, they made it look so easy. Instead I fell off a lot, drifted down wind, even hit a rock and scratched up my foil, barely got up foiling a couple times and spent a lot of time underpowered trudging around.

Need more time and more wind!

johndg
WA, 114 posts
4 Apr 2020 2:20PM
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You need a solid wind to start 18knots to 23 would be good depending on the wing and foil sizes you use. This is just to start. So hang in there.

hilly
WA, 5260 posts
4 Apr 2020 2:29PM
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Youngbreezy said..
Well I just had my first go at winging and despite having watched a lot of videos of people who rip I actually didn't get up and start shredding instantly!

Wierd I know, they made it look so easy. Instead I fell off a lot, drifted down wind, even hit a rock and scratched up my foil, barely got up foiling a couple times and spent a lot of time underpowered trudging around.

Need more time and more wind!


Where did you go? No wind today.

Macca1410
NSW, 38 posts
7 Apr 2020 9:52PM
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Wind never seems to be quite enough so looking to get a 6m wing to go with my 4m.

Should I stick with the Ozone Wasp seeing I am used to it and like it or get the Naish S25 which is obviously a newer design. About a $350-$400 difference in price mind you.

Bought a new steamer wetsuit so plan to go out through winter if conditions permit.

Thanks

IWB
165 posts
7 Apr 2020 8:13PM
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Hey Macca,
The 6m Ozone wasp is a solid choice if looking to get going earlier. I use the 6m from about 12-19kts. I have mainly been using the Starboard foils, 1700, 2000 and 2400 and switch up with the wings to maximize my wind range and the type of conditions. Since you have the naish foil 1650, I would recommend adding the 2000 and even the 2450 foils to your quiver so to maximize your wind range.



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"Looking to start wing foiling" started by Macca1410